Family lawyer of Ian Bush believes he was targeted by RCMP

SCOTT SUTHERLAND

Canadian Press

Latest comment posted at 8:36 PM EDT 24/05/07

Lawyer says Bush was taken back to the detachment so officers could teach him a lesson ...Thi  
  1. Buckwheat Bubba from Nanaimo, Canada writes: It is everyone's false except Bush's. Wow what a unique defence strategy.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 7:50 PM EDT |
  2. Rick Drysdale from Sidney, Canada writes: You said it Bubba. This is a typical defense stratagy.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 7:52 PM EDT |
  3. Just a Canadian from Canada writes: Bullies, incompetent and arrogant. The arrogance of power has made them totally unaccountable to the public who they pretend to serve.

    Just disband them and see where they can find alternative jobs. Shame on you
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:01 PM EDT |
  4. Jack Be Nimble (Jack be Quick) from Canada writes: Buckwheat Bubba, Rick Drysdale, Just a Canadian: the Three Stooges.

    Perhaps I'll call you three loafers if I ever get mugged.

    No thanks. I'll take an incompetent police force over you three idiots any time.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:22 PM EDT |
  5. Joly Blough from Canada writes: ok.Just a Canadian.you remember your words the next time something happens to you or your family and you need a police presence or maybe you should move someplace where a corrupt,uncivilized army controls.We have it good in this country,too good I'd say from the comments narrow minded people post .
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:26 PM EDT |
  6. Just a Canadian from Canada writes: Jack Be Nimble (Jack be Quick) - My buddy, my bubba, get real. Read the posts again. The first two guys are trashing defense, i.e. for police. It is just me who has so far said that it is incompetent police force.

    Already had too much to drink. You owe an apology to your two friends and supporters of your views.

    It appears that you not only support incompenent police force but also illetrate posters like yourself.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:29 PM EDT |
  7. I R from Canada writes: Is there not a presumption that any death that occurs to a detainee while held in custody of the RCMP (or any other police force for that matter) is considered suspicious?

    Why was the body not refrigerated? Did not the RCMP have standard operating procedures? Did not the doctor on scene order preservation? Was there a doctor on scene? I don't understand this.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:32 PM EDT |
  8. Jerome Garcia from Canada writes: Obviously the police perform a valuable service in Canada, the same as Fire fighters, teachers, paramedics, city workers, taxi drivers, construction workers, sanitation workers, etc. The issue is whether it was a good judgement call to shoot Ian Bush in the back of the head and the disturbing lack of both video evidence and the sheer improbability of the police officers statement regarding the sequence of events and the destruction of his notes of the incident the two day delay in autopsy etc etc.
    Faith in the police does not mean carte blanche for murder.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 8:38 PM EDT |
  9. Steve Riddle from Ontario, writes: Oh yeah, a shot to the back of the head in self-defence! Like that is believable. Come on, this cop is so crooked, it's a wonder he can walk to tim hortons. And it is embarasing to canada that the rcmp (and the new west cops) back him up so completely. Let's go burn a barn, or erase some surveillance tapes!

    Kudos to Mason (and the G&M) for his dogged following of this story!
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:00 PM EDT |
  10. red marabunta from Barbados writes: Targeted??? what a load of shite. Constable Koester erred in trying to appease this drunk. Let this be a lesson for our police, no appeasement, cuff em and throw them in the tank. Lets see how mouthy they are in the cold light of dawn. Thank you constable Koester for standing up to drunken yobos like bush.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:08 PM EDT |
  11. Joe Flow from Canada writes: Blatant second degree murder, by a cop against a civilian, with cops investigating cops. Come on, this is as blatant as it gets, and to have cops investigating other cops is beyond ridiculous. Of course it will be completely whitewashed.

    This is a tradgedy that will not be dealt with fairly by the 'justice' system, and perhaps the only redress possible will be on the streets or in a civil court. Witnessing incidents like this makes one completely lose faith in our current justice system, and to a certain extent...in humanity.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:09 PM EDT |
  12. right winger from Victoria, Canada writes: Anyone who could read the events as the RCMP have invented then in the absence of any tapes (stole and/or erased) or witnesses (murdered) has to already have a hold in his/her head. If this were a story that originated in, say, Mexico, there would a thousand posters ranting about how incompetent the Mexican police are. Some people need to take their blinders off. Cops are the power-hungry juice monkeys who weren't smart enough to become lawyers or even politicians, not patient enough to become teachers, nor fit enough to become firefighters, but after six arduous WEEKS of training know just enough about the Criminal Code, when combined with batons, tasers, pepper spray and guns, to present a clear and present danger to normal, everyday citizens. That anybody could defend a cop murdering - and then COVERING UP in such an obvious way - a 19-year-old kid, you need to re-evaluate your world view.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:16 PM EDT |
  13. D E from Canada writes: Incompetent, police action IMO - a young man's alcohol infraction leads and is escalated to possible provoked manslaughter. This could be one of your sons or brothers someday - think about it !
    The officer just instigated further reaction from Mr. Bush until he could justify brutalizing him. Police investigating themselves ? Does that make sense ? How about mandatory video footage when a suspect or detainee is brought in. How else can this be prevented in the future ? This is already smelling of a coverup.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:26 PM EDT |
  14. Truth Searcher from Vancouver, Canada writes: Too many things don't make sense in the officer's testimony to be believable. As long as cops investigate cops the truth of events will never be told. Another case of cops protecting cops. Before the RCMP started refering to themselves as 'members' the only other group(s) that refered to themselves as 'members' were biker gangs. Seems fitting somehow. I for one no longer have any faith or respect for the RCMP and think it's time they were sent packing and local communities had their own police force drawing from those that live there. They always get their man alright. Just shoot em!
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:28 PM EDT |
  15.  
    Tom Alderman from Vancouver, Canada writes: Things would have been a LOT better if Bush had simply beaten this cop to death. Canadians do not like the police and do not respect them - now it will be necessary to take revenge on this pig and pop a cap in the back of his head and in the back of the head of a lot of other pigs. There is a line up of Canadians ready to do this. canadians do not need brutal oppresive police forces and they should all be disbanded now!
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:29 PM EDT |
  16. uninterested observer from Canada writes: right winger from Victoria, curious where you got the 'six arduous WEEKS of training' thing, check their website, its 24 weeks training, followed by 6 months supervision at the detstchment. At least TRY and use some facts!
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:34 PM EDT |
  17. Jasper the Black Lab from Vancouver, Canada writes: If my failure to follow proper procedures at work resulted in someone's death I would be be fired immediately. Next, my professional association would grill me pretty good. Maybe they would give me the boot too, especially if I destroyed my original notes and submitted a report written 3 weeks after the tradgedy.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:34 PM EDT |
  18. evelyn robinson from Canada writes: It certainly does sound like this rookie officer was taking himself too seriously and decided to teach Bush a lesson. It does seem obvious that he did knee Bush in the groin. This may well have set Bush off.
    But let's not attack a respected country wide police force because of a few bad apples. Northern towns don't get the cream of the crop.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:46 PM EDT |
  19. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: I liked reading the part about how the father, Bush Senior, told the cop to F-Off at the Coroners inquest. A really classy piece of crap that father Bush is. It looks like the fruit didnt fall far from the tree in this family. Instead of blaiming yourself its always easier to blame somebody else. The younger Bush, the criminal with a criminal past, was drunk out of his mind, 160 milligrams, and thought he was going to be given a break by the young cop. When little Bush found out he was being charged with obstruction he acted out like his father probably would have. He started punching the crap out of the cop. The young Bush told the cop to breath his last breath and he began to choke him to death. The cop tried to beat him off with the butt of his gun. The young Bush turned his head to avoid the beating and kept choking. I am glad the Bush is dead and the cop survived this ordeal. Parents take care of your kids. Teach them about getting pissed drunk in public places where kids are present. Parents teach your kids not to drink and drive and flee when the cops are trying to pull you over. Teach your kids not to use the F bomb in a crowded court room. Teach your kids that if you try to kill a cop, you might just end up dying yourself.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:46 PM EDT |
  20. Randy D from Canada writes: It matters not if 90% or whatever of police officers are hard-working, honest and dedicated if there is a concerted effort at coverup they are all cast in a bad light. How you anti-victim types can justify the shoddy police work is beyond me. Had the result been opposite you can be assured they would have left no stone unturned to prosecute the perpetrator. Your double standard amazes and appals me. Every bit of testimony sounds contrived. I, like most of you (I think) want the truth to come out whatever it may be. I am afraid that is not happening when people blindly go to one side no matter the facts. That is every bit as frightening as a police force who's credibility is going in the toilet.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 9:58 PM EDT |
  21. john brett from Canada writes: Why aren't you bunch of police haters writing about the beer bottle that bush used during his attack on the officer? Or do you only have a selective memory?
    Thank God that this officer was able to overcome his attacker. But what if he wasn't what would you guys be saying??? 'Well he could have reached up and shot the guy in his head...' but wait thats what he did and thats why the officer is alive.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 10:03 PM EDT |
  22. Bob Rae Hey from Attawa, Canada writes: This is Harper's fault, he's sucking up to GWB and Mexico. Harper should have taken control of this matter as I would have if I were PM.

    Hi the US with Surcharges, penalty fees, special levies, and regulations, this is what Canada needs to do. Harper is a bush lover.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 10:19 PM EDT |
  23. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: It matters not if 90% or whatever of lawyers are hard-working, honest and dedicated. If there is a concerted effort at making up nonsense to fit your political agenda, all lawyers are cast in a bad light. How you pro-victim types can justify the dishonest lawyers spinning is beyond me. Your double standard amazes and appals me. Every bit of nonsense the lawyer and family spews sounds contrived. I, like most of you (I think) want the truth to come out whatever it may be. I am afraid that is not happening when family members and paid lawyers go to one side, no matter the facts. That is every bit as frightening as the legal proffesion who's credibility is going further into the toilet.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 10:21 PM EDT |
  24. Chris Gray from Canada writes: Leftwing, you take the father to task for telling the cop to F-Off? The father lost his son. His son is dead, at the hands of a cop whose story is suspect. Do you have any inkling of how devastating that is? Add the fact of the delay, destroyed notes, unexplained bruises to Bush's groin, no bruises to the cop's neck, no video, etc. etc. and anyone would be justified in being angry, never mind the father. Why don't you cut the family (and lawyer) a break - they are the only ones speaking up for Ian Bush. The cop has a phalanx of protection in front of him, and will never be called to answer for this incident in any meaningful way. Par for the course when it comes to the police.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 10:46 PM EDT |
  25. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: The father is an idiot and I am sure the younger Bush learned everything he knew from his father, the idiot. Taking off from the cops while you are drunk behind the wheel is a stupid thing to do. Drinking in public and getting so intoxicated your blood level is 160 is a stupid thing to do. lying to the cops twice about your name to avoid detection for your previous criminal past, is a stupid thing to do. Attacking a cop, beating a cop, and then whispering in his ear that he is about to breathe his last breath, is a stupid thing to do. Then we hear that the father tells the cop to F-Off in a crowded court room. It is only logical that the kid learned to be a goof from his father. Like father like son....No the kid didnt deserve to die. That’s the banter of babies who cant debate. The punk tried to kill the cop, the cop lived, end of story. I just thank god it was the cop that lived. Too many young rookie RCMP cops are getting killed in this country. Shame on the RCMP for not ensuring each detachment isn’t equipped with proper audio/visual equipment. Shame on the RCMP for understaffing detachments. But most of all, SHAME ON BUSH SENIOR. Bush senior turned his kid into a killer and died trying to kill a cop....something that Bush senior will have to live with the rest of his life.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:02 PM EDT |
  26. bob london from Canada writes: LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada. Obviously you are still an idiot if you live in the Fort. Why don't you watch the Vanderhoof cops transporting by your front door instead of dumb @*$ small town thinking.

    Get a life. RCMP are a joke. Why do you think the Highway of Tears still exists or do you promote it as a tourist destination.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:08 PM EDT |
  27. donald kennedy from prince george, Canada writes:
    For forty-five years I have been proud of what I still think is the finest police force in the world. I have seen police officers from the RCMP tell the truth on the stand when a slight deviation woould have brought a conviction. It is terrible to attack those who guard you while you sleep.
    Those standards have taken a beating recently with a culture of undercover lying and violence sanctioned by the courts as well as statements taken under what is tantamount to torture also court sanctioned.
    Something must be done to bring back the respect these men who still
    are truthful deserve.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:08 PM EDT |
  28. G G from BC, Canada writes: Chris Gray: Conspiracy right? The parents are in grief (ever been there?)
    the boy dies but he has been on that track for some time. Then you mix in the asper empire who play up these grief situations - sells papers - add a little lawyer who likes publicity (trial by press) - mix in a lot of guilt from parents whose possible failure is now their reality and you have this tragedy. Its easy to wise crack about this young cop - but I bet none of you have what it takes to try to do his job. ERobinson you should try writing fiction with the media - your pretty good connecting dots even when there not one the same page.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:10 PM EDT |
  29. Paul Chretian from Canada writes: Left wing: I like your post. Its obvious the kid was trouble and unfortunately his actions got him killed. I know the RCMP is under a cloud of suspicion and rightfully so but when the facts surface I believe that the RCMP will be exonerated on this one.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:11 PM EDT |
  30. Paul Chretian from Canada writes: Tom Alderman: I think your having trouble expressing yourself. You definetely need anger management and or a long prison sentence to cool down. Are you a postal worker by chance.
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:19 PM EDT |
  31. donald kennedy from prince george, Canada writes:
    The courts have let paid killers testify at the behest of Rcmp who have employed them as agents.They have sucessfully used people posing as gang members committing offences who are RCMP members . The courts have said that accused person in custody has a right to silence, while admitting evidence obtained after 36 hours straight of interrogation where the police have continually suggested what the answers should be.Take me back to the days before the Charter. What ethics is an honest young cop supposed to have?
    • Posted 24/05/07 at 11:39 PM EDT |
  32.  
    Jeff Miller from Victoria, Canada writes: The tragedy of this entire affair is the fact that Ian Bush is dead. I find it so repulsive and sickening to read some of the posts that ridicule Mr. Bush and is father. By all accounts Ian Bush was a happy go lucky typical young man. Did he deserve to die in this way, absolutely not. At first I had an open mind about this tragedy. As I learn more I am very troubled by what is coming out. The rcmp officer burned his notes - very interesting. He didn't give a statement for weeks - another interesting point. What he describes as happening appears to be physically impossible - yet another disturbing event. The one that seals it for me, there was no video tape in the machine recording all this - that my fellow citizens says it all. I have absolutely zero trust in a police force (rcmp) that by all accounts is completely out of control, accountable to no one and acts without any regard to protecting the very rights that we (Canadians) supposedly have enshrined in the Charter of Rights. Look no further than the circus in Ottawa where you have senior rcmp officers appearing under oath in front of a committee all telling a different story. If that doesn't tell you something nothing else will. Time after time well respected and good police officers have left the rcmp because they can't work in an organization that is a lawless entity where bullying, intimidation, cover-up, lies and manipulation are all the norm. The tragic death of Ian Bush has exposed once again the fact this corrupt organization will do anything to protect itself. Until the events in Ottawa started to play out for all to see they were able to get away with it. To those who say the attack against the rcmp is nothing but a typical defence lawyers trick you should think again. If the rcmp have nothing to hide they should embrace and insist on an outside agency to oversee their affairs to ensure the highest ethical standards. After all, thats what its all about isn't it????
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:18 AM EDT |
  33. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: The father is an idiot and I am sure the younger Bush learned everything he knew from his father, the idiot. Taking off from the cops while you are drunk behind the wheel is a stupid thing to do. Drinking in public and getting so intoxicated your blood level is 160 is a stupid thing to do. lying to the cops twice about your name to avoid detection for your previous criminal past, is a stupid thing to do. Attacking a cop, beating a cop, and then whispering in his ear that he is about to breathe his last breath, is a stupid thing to do. Then we hear that the father tells the cop to F-Off in a crowded court room. It is only logical that the kid learned to be a goof from his father. Like father like son....No the kid didnt deserve to die. That’s the banter of babies who cant debate. The punk tried to kill the cop, the cop lived, end of story. I just thank god it was the cop that lived. Too many young rookie RCMP cops are getting killed in this country. Shame on the RCMP for not ensuring each detachment isn’t equipped with proper audio/visual equipment. Shame on the RCMP for understaffing detachments. But most of all, SHAME ON BUSH SENIOR. Bush senior turned his kid into a killer and died trying to kill a cop....something that Bush senior will have to live with the rest of his life.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:28 AM EDT |
  34. When you eat your smarties, do you eat the red ones last? from Canada writes: I posted this theory a few days ago on here...... go back and read my MOTIVE story about the Bush murder..... should I change my name to Sherlock??

    I AM ALWAYS AHEAD OF THE NEWS AND FIGURED THIS CRIME OUT BEFORE ANYONE ELSE, WHO'S YOUR DADDY KIDS????
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:31 AM EDT |
  35.  
    G. Veneta from Calgary, Canada writes: No young man deserves capital punishment for having an open beer. Things just don't add up here. The officer should have more skills to subdue a young man so a shot to the head isn't necessary. Brutality regardless of what Bush did.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:44 AM EDT |
  36. Chris Gray from Canada writes: Leftwing, You obviously believe every word the sole survivor is telling. You have claimed Ian Bush is a 'killer.' Did he have a record? No. Did he have a reputation as a thug? No. Was he known as a decent, if imperfect (as we all are) guy? Yes. We have only the word of his assailant telling us how horrible Bush was in those last few moments. There are two sides to every story, and due to one party being dead, we are hearing only one. Methinks you are a cop; who else would take one side so fiercely, calling the man who is angry at his son's death an idiot? Questions need to be asked and answered. Or are you one that believes 'the public doesn't have the right to know anything?'
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:51 AM EDT |
  37. M j from Toronto, Canada writes: Leftwing, you are remarkably offensive. I'll bet you get punched a lot. If not, you should be.

    Your story is simply a fabrication. There is no evidence at all to suggest that events played out the way you describe. Two men entered a room, one apparently drunk and unarmed, the other sober and armed. When the door opens again, the drunk man is dead, his body bruised, with a bullet through the back of his head. The sober man is unhurt. There is no other evidence. Who is the criminal?

    Occam's Razor answers the question quite easily. Which is more likely? That the unarmed man, in a completely uncharacteristic attack, somehow managed to overcome the 6'4' armed officer and was shot in the back of the head while choking the officer from behind? Or that somehow a scuffle ensued and the officer (accidentally?) fired his weapon while pistol whipping the man he had just groined and who was doubled over in pain?
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:52 AM EDT |
  38. M j from Toronto, Canada writes: Also, Leftwing, 'weirdo' is spelled as such, you illiterate cow-tipper.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:55 AM EDT |
  39.  
    G. Veneta from Calgary, Canada writes: Losing a child is the worst horror for any parent. The cop is lucky Mr. Bush only told him to f.o. as many fathers in a rage of grief at the person who killed his son may have been driven to much more.

    Whomever suggests Mr. Bush was out of line has never experienced this type of mind numbing profound senseless loss.

    The RCMP here look very bad. Destroyed notes and 2 days for an autopsy? That just doesn't happen. Seems obvious a coverup was in the works and notes re-written to suit the new story.

    So sorry for Bush's family and friends. That RCMP member should be removed or have permanent desk duty without a firearm as evidently he can't control it.

    When will the RCMP regain credibility?
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:58 AM EDT |
  40. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: Hmmmmm do I believe a 6 month member of the RCMP or do I believe some bottom feeding politically motivated lawyer who wasn’t there when the Bush boy tried to kill the cop. Do I believe some headline grabby bottom feeder or the cop? I will take this cops story over the lawyers story, hands down. Thats all the lawyer has...some fantasy made up of complete crap. How dare him spin it the way he is spinning it just to grab a headline in the Globe and Mail. The punk Bush had a record of being drunk, fleeing from the cops and ditching his car. The punk was hammered when he lied about his name twice to the cops. His father is a prick too and illustrated nicely that his fruit didn’t fall far from his tree. 'The cop is lucky Mr. Bush only told him to f.o. as many fathers in a rage of grief at the person who killed his son may have been driven to much more' So do you think the father might have tried to kill the cop too if he could have? Perhaps whisper again those famous last words....your about to breathe your last breath. I hope not. I hope Bush senior doesn’t go on some sort of witch hunt for the young copper. Hopefully Bush senior can compose himself, realize his shortcomings and attempt to reconcile to himself what he can do better in the future. Violence is not the answer.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 1:19 AM EDT |
  41. Bob Rae Hey from Attawa, Canada writes: If the RCMP had not 'targeted' Bush he could not have shot him in the middle of his head,

    Dion is the next leader, he will stop criminals from getting what they deserve. Dion is the man.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 1:37 AM EDT |
  42. sun vann from nelson, bc, Canada writes: Left Wing (Nut): You wrote: violence is not the answer .

    Good words, however ALL your postings sound and come across as 'violent'

    Unbelievable is the RCMP's story !! This is a coverup !!
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 1:37 AM EDT |
  43. Bob Rae Hey from Attawa, Canada writes:
    Most Liberals are dishonest and lie. But this would not be a fair statement without qualifing that only the elected Liberals steal money from Canadians.

    Liberals as a hole are liars and thieves.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 1:51 AM EDT |
  44. ALASTAIR JAMES BERRY from Nanaimo BC CANADA, Canada writes: Questions:

    Why did the investigation take so long that the evidence grew cold? Who suggested and permitted the delay?? Surely investigations are instituted immediately. Two weeks would be enough. I have seen fatal aircraft accidents fully investigated in 2 weeks with the team working day and night!!

    Why and when did the surveillance cameras go off?? Are there any tapes apart from audio that might give a clue as to why there were no camera tapes covering the incident.

    Where are the photos of the CRIME SCENE?? Surely police work being what it is, dozens would be taken.

    Who cleaned up the blood stains on the walls or were they cleaned then painted over??

    These loose ends still might suggest a deliberate coverup.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 2:00 AM EDT |
  45. Former Royal from Canada writes: I read a lot of criticism of the RCMP's handling of this situation. Let's examine them, shall we? #1 - No tape in the video camera: He was releasing Ian Bush from custody, not interrogating him. There is no need to videotape signing release docs - officers do it in their cruisers all the time. #2 - Comparing sizes & abilities: One reason the 'sleeperhold' is so effective is because it works so well on people who are bigger/stronger/tougher than you. This is why the constable feared he was about to die - because he knew it was over if he didn't shoot. #3 - They 'targeted' Bush - maybe maybe not. But the officers of the detachment anticipated the open beer at the hockey game, which is why they were there to begin with. Bush, who'd had run-ins with police before, lied to police twice about his identity (Criminal offence), which is why he was arrested. No other tickets? Probably because Bush was being arrested for a federal offence (not provincial liquor violation). #4 - Burned his notes? I have no idea why he would do that. Makes no sense at all. #5 - 'Capital Punishment for Open Beer': No, Bush was shot while attempting to murder a human being. He was being let go when he attacked Koester. #6 - Physically impossible to shoot given the situation: If the pair are on their knees, facing the same direction, with Bush holding Koester in a headlock/sleeper hold with his left arm, Koester is bent over at the waist and Bush slightly to Koester's right, his only possible response is to draw with his Right arm (which is behind Bush's back) and shoot (targets possible: back of head, back of torso & lower back). Not at all impossible, I'd say. #7 - 'Cops investigating Cops': Who else should do the investigating? Are there any civilian bodies that perform murder investigations? Not many, that's for sure. Private forensic labs? Nope. Lastly, we've had 6 RCMP officers killed in the last two-three years on duty - any wonder officers are defending themselves these days?
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 2:06 AM EDT |
  46. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: Its funny how lawyers advocate for a civilian body to investigate the police or a Special Investigation Unit (SIU) which would become filled with more left wing wackos. The lawyers advocate for civilian oversight yet when a lawyer breaks the law and a lot of them do, and no criminal charges are being sought, who investigates? THE LAW SOCIETY! You got a complaint about a lawyer charging you too much fees....take it to the LAW SOCIETY. Your lawyer doing something unethical...take it to the LAW SOCIETY. They are a JOKE! Lawyers that volunteer for these high profile cases and beg the media to put them on each night, are all opportunists and hypocrites. For Sun Vann....this is a very violent and gross incident. Would you prefer the story be sugar coated? Some drunken thug tried to murder a young cop and the cop blasted his brains out in self defence. It does not get much more violent than that. As for burning notes: Notes made and used in preparation of a written statement about to be submitted to your lawyer are privledged. Its a simple lawyer client priviledge. The cop is entitled to counsel just as is any other person in Canada. Everybody has the right to seek counsel and everybody has the right to keep their mouth shut. The cops notes in his police notebook were not destroyed and he did sumbit a detailed report on the incident. This is all just more BS from an oportunist lawyer who just loves being on the news each night. The lawyer spews the BS and it gets picked up by the left wing press and wackos and repeat the BS as if it is true.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 2:27 AM EDT |
  47. John Callaghan from Canada writes: The RCMP needs an independent body to overview the force. This resembles an assassination, not an interview gone bad. We have to accept this was a rookie cop, a mistake was made, and proceed from there. But to argue this was Ian Bush's fault is reprehensible.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 2:27 AM EDT |
  48. LEFTWING WIERDOS from Fort St James, Canada writes: Ok...I will take the bait once again....this is amusing.

    ' to argue this was Ian Bush's fault is reprehensible'

    Hello.....the kid tried to kill a cop....the drunk punk whispered to the cop breathe your last breath.

    Of course its Bush's fault he is dead. The cop was going to release him and was in the process of doing so. The kids dead and its the kids fault.

    I am so glad another young mountie has not died this time.

    In assessing blame some should go to the family too. What kind of jerk did they raise. Fleeing from the cops, drunk driving, drinking in public, lying about his name, assaulting a police officer. Nice Job!
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 2:40 AM EDT |
  49. Offshore Directional Driller from Thailand writes: This guy sounds like no sweetheart. What in the hell were they drinking outside of a arena for in the first place. Ever heard of the change room or even a bar. Also, who would believe anything a lawyer says. They are paid huge some of money to come up with creative lies. Bush made a series of bad judgements and unfortunately paid the ultimate price. From my point of view he was in the wrong for drinking publicly, lying, and then stupidly fighting in the cop shop. You hvae to be blind drunk to think you could beat a cop then walk out of the station. No one wins.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 3:13 AM EDT |
  50. MIchelle Hruschka from Canada writes: On a previous post by leftwing weirdo's, he makes a comment about drinking in public. Considering a story here in Ontario, where off duty police were caught on video drinking in public makes it ok, just because they are police officers, right???

    Sounds like a good old double standard to me.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 6:56 AM EDT |
  51. gord winters from Canada writes: LEFTWING WIERDOS sounds like a cop. they really are that stupid.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 3:24 AM EDT |
  52. Al , from Maritimes, Canada writes: I'd like to know the percentage of respondents to this Blog are RCMP. It looks very much like there is a group of people here doing damage control.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 7:11 AM EDT |
  53. Vern McPherson from Toronto, Canada writes: Well we support and are grateful for our fine young men and wmen on the police forces who do a terriffic job under difficult circumstances. I admire their courage and their committment to serve the public.

    But we will not have them shooting citizens in the back of the Fu..... head for no reason.

    Why are the cops notes destroyed ? Right there I have a prob. And don't tell me it's because of some procedure in some manual somewhere. This case has been in the public eye from day one.

    Why were the notes destroyed ?
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 7:32 AM EDT |
  54. john brett from Canada writes: Vern McPherson: His notebook notes were not destroyed, they are intact. He made separate notes on scrapes of paper while writing his statement, the scrapes of paper were the so called "notes" that were destroyed.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 7:53 AM EDT |
  55. Winged Avenger from Toronto, Canada writes: MIchelle Hruschka, you make a great point. I remember reading that..I also remember that the police upon being discovered chased down the two guys filming etc...Anyway according to left wing nut job I guess that is ok because after all they are police right? Also to those who obsolve the officer because Ian Bush whispered "take your last breath?" Give me a break...If this where the other way around the defence would be laughed out of court..What an increadibley flimsy excuse..it's like they aren't even trying to cover it up anymore...What a joke. The fact that so much proceedural work was fudged speaks volumes...Officer Koeker may we have your notes on the incident..Oh those..I destroyed them..I didn't think they where important. LOL Ok whatever. Also left win nutjob you admonish the father for telling the officer to F*ck off yet here you are doing the same thing to people here that disagree with you..Imagine what you would say if someone killed your kid? I mean you sound just like the people you are admonishing hypocrite.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:06 AM EDT |
  56. john brett from Canada writes: Winged Avenge wrote "those who obsolve the officer because Ian Bush whispered "take your last breath?"
    No we support his actions b/c he was being choked to death.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:14 AM EDT |
  57. MIchelle Hruschka from Canada writes: Winged Avenger: I realize that police do play an important role in our society. There are many who try their best to be good representives to the public. I would curse at anyone who killed my son, I do not care who you are, it is an reasonable emotional response.
    There is another story printed in hamilton spectator yesterday about police officers. The police reponded to a 911 call where a 79 year old man may of had some sort of mental breakdown??, anyways the incident is somewhat worrying to me because I think that the response from the police should of been handled in a different way, given the gentleman's age. They went way over the top in my opinion.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:28 AM EDT |
  58. Mai Larebilaton from Toronto, Canada writes:

    1. Interrogation room video tape missing;

    2. Const. Koester's duty notes destroyed;

    3. Ian Bush's body inexplicably not refrigerated for 3 days before autopsy.

    If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, its not an innocent cop.

    Disband the RCMP now. The entire force is corrupt beyond comprehension.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:39 AM EDT |
  59. garlick toast from mill village, Canada writes: we've had some examples of bad behavior in nova scotia by mounties.
    after the murder of sarg't..derek burkeholder,in an unrelated incident,an obviously mentally deranged man,armed with an axe, was shot to death by several cops.this was done at distance,not hand-to-hand combat.after the funeral for burkeholder,agroup of uniformed mounties became so drunk and abusive at a local watering hole that the server had to call the town cops.following a discussion between the two forces,the mounties left,drove away,in fact.the whole episode was unreported until frank magazine got ahold of it.the the chronicle herald covered the story and action was taken.early retirement for one and reposting to a northern community for another,the others skated.
    they,with their actions,fouled their uniforms and dishonoured a very fine man,derek burkeholder.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:48 AM EDT |
  60. Russ Kehoe from Canada writes: It was murder!
    His gun went off when he used it to pistol whip the victim.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:49 AM EDT |
  61. Vern McPherson from Toronto, Canada writes: john brett from Canada writes: Vern McPherson: His notebook notes were not destroyed, they are intact. He made separate notes on scrapes of paper while writing his statement, the scrapes of paper were the so called "notes" that were destroyed.

    ------------------------

    John thank you much for that clarificaton.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:56 AM EDT |
  62. Randy D from Canada writes: To the unlearned gentleman from Forskin James. Don't put me in the court of defending lawyers. Nevertheless, did the lawyer dump the tape. Did the lawyer leave the body unrefrigerated for days prior to the autopsy. Did the lawyer screw up the autopsy. Did the lawyer have his colleagues supervise the autopsy. Did the lawyer shoot a guy in the back of the head and have no marks to back up his contention of being in fear for his life. Do lawyers investigate themselves. If they do, they shouldn't... Methinks if you had a brain you would be outside playing with it.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 8:59 AM EDT |
  63. Winged Avenger from Toronto, Canada writes: John Brett. Sorry I should have added that all we have is thie officers word for the events in question...From what I read the officer didn't have any marks on his neck that would indicate a chocking...However why did Mr. Bush have bruises on his inner thigh? Anyway all I am saying is that the official story has more holes then swiss cheese.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:12 AM EDT |
  64. Barry Kojima from Hamilton, ON, Canada writes: The open beers were anticipated? At a hockey game no less!

    Ahhhh... that in itself justifies a large police presence.

    Police = Cluster B Personality Disorder.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:14 AM EDT |
  65. andrew macmillan from amherst,ns, Canada writes: The RCMP are not Bad Cops there is just bad leadership. It's the culture of being the law. The culture of standing back to back against all that oppose them, question them. They depend on the loyality of the group and demand loyality from within. There is not enough separation of duties the RCMP is so all encompassing. There jurisdiction is too overreaching, there are no checks and balance. Even when their is an investigation performed by a municipal police force as in this case cops give cops the benefit of the doubt. With or without the wink and a nod, cops give cops more latitude. Far too often the government has given the RCMP duty after duty, when a job needs doing the RCMP are called on to perform it. Like Formal Royal, said, who else is going to investigate these events, someone should. When something goes wrong there is a cause, the RCMP are too willing to blame the killing of cops on crazyes, they are not critical of thier own procedures. Like watching a suspect's barn from a duck blind from across a field with night vision and thermal vision knowing the suspect had weapons and not from inside the outbuilding with all lights blazing. Giving the suspect the element of surprise along with knowing the terrain. The RCMP's culture of authority doesn't allow them to step back and let situations cool with an hour or a day. A cop once said to me "we have better things to do than screw with with you", but when we got outside and I saw the 5 cruisers I realize that they didn't have anything better to do than screw with me. Cops it always their way, this time, and every time, and hurry up. Because I've got a large Tim's with 6 sugars waiting for me.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:22 AM EDT |
  66. john brett from Canada writes: Winged Avenger: Ok I see where you were going... But the type of choke that was used was a reverse choke. In this the attacker's bicep and forearm are squeezed together to execute the "choke". The arm is in a "V" around the victim's neck, from behind, this type of choke does not create bruises. A very sore throat, yes. If he had been choked from the front, by Bush's hands (fingers in to the throat) I would agree with you on the lack of bruises.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:29 AM EDT |
  67. Kaz Osuchowski from Canada writes: Could have been an accident, manslaughter, self defense.. But overall it had been a poor training (or a bad candidate for a policeman), in all its aspects. Even if we assume the cop was fighting for his life, he could have started with shooting the guy in the foot, thigh, shin or may be I would start shooting in the air. The head, in a position he discribed he was, (pretty impossible to imagine) its the last place to shoot at..
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:48 AM EDT |
  68. Dave G from Canada writes: "Dr. Stefanelli said the post mortem showed a gun had been partially pressed to Mr. Bush's head."

    Smells very much like an execution.

    I was frequently enraged by antagonists I encountered when I was a police officer (six years) but I retained my composure and have never killed anybody in the line of duty.

    This officer needs an urgent psychological evaluation and if found unfit then he ought to be required to leave the service immediately.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:54 AM EDT |
  69. Jasper the Black Lab from Vancouver, Canada writes: Corporal Derek Donovan was the first to arrive at the scene of the slaying. He found Corporal Koester lying on the floor, distraught and crying. Donovan's first words were "its not your fault...".

    The Mounties culture of self-protection and deceit kicked in immediately.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 9:59 AM EDT |
  70. Michael Leblanc from Toronto, Canada writes: I never cease to be amazed at the clairoyance of my fellow citizens in their posts here, as they seem to know exactly what happened that night. When it's a living person's word against a dead person's, things get a bit complicated and all evidence must be closely examined. I look forward to every stone unturned over to get to the truth. I have nothing against the police, quite the opposite in fact. But I do have something against systemic corruption, especially in organizations which have control (in this case direct control) over citizens' lives. Because, as I have said, the only person who could directly contradict the shooter's version is dead. It's obvious enough that the officer in question is at the very least an unreliable witness because of the position he's in and it's equally obvious and has been shown in cases involving police and other large orgs over the years, that wagons tend to circle to protect their own. This seems especially true in the case of the RCMP - such wagon-circling and indeed blatant lying has ironically come to the fore especially in the past year. This makes one fundamentally question their honesty. To me, the string of coincidences (camera off, no criminal record, low blood alcohol level, no history of violent behaviour in the vitim's personal life, no regrigeration of the body, the fact that the cop was a rookie) still leaves a lot of unanswered questions. But I will try to keep as open a mind as possible as this process unfolds.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 10:08 AM EDT |
  71. Scott O from Toronto, Canada writes: Anyone find it odd that you can’t go into a convenience store or a mall in our country without being on a surveillance camera the entire time yet we don’t have them in a location known for complaints, criminals and guns. It sure as hell would be easier on all these police who have to continuously defend their innocence of police brutality if they could just back up their stories with a very clear and audible video. Well if they work at the one particular moment the incident occurs that is!!!
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 10:20 AM EDT |
  72. Allen Stewart from Vancouver, Canada writes: How get away with murder?...join the RCMP. How to get rid of the evidence? Join the RCMP.

    Murderous pack of devils they are. This is a complete coverup from A-Z. I am astounded!
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 10:59 AM EDT |
  73. P Sullivan from Canada, Canada writes: I have lived with several RCMP and am friends with members of the RCMP. When you are considered part of the group, well let's just say they talk. Believe me there are some very good people and very scary people in the RCMP. I am still reminded of the one young cop who talked way to much about killing someone. Yes, he is still in the force. Some of them you can trust with your life, others scare the hell out of me. No, a large number of them are not very honest. Their moto is to do what ever it takes to enhance their ego/career.
    This Houston deal looks a little smelly even for the RCMP.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 11:31 AM EDT |
  74. Byron L. Jolley from Toronto, Canada writes: Am I to understand whenever lawyers run out of legitimate evidence, they turn to 'what they believe?' Stop trying to create situations which detour the public from what actually happened. If one wants to be the king of the hill, a smart guy and a real tough guy who fears no one,...well, somebody will eventually come along and take care of him. That's what happened here. Case closed. Thank God for our dedicated police officers.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 11:37 AM EDT |
  75. F.A. T. from Canada, Canada writes: Since there has never been one proven case of a police officer lying (let alone assaulting/murdering anyone), the officer in question should be completely believed. It doesn't matter that for some reason there was no video evidence at that particular moment.

    Seriously though, I have seen several instances of officers aggressively antagonizing people for no good reason... e.g. middle aged, sober people going for a stroll on Whyte Avenue; an elderly man simply asking an officer a non-pointed question, etc.... many officers (not the majority) have serious power-trip issues. As a young man my belief in the professionalism of all officers was irreparably harmed; I now know that there are all kinds (good & bad) in the force.

    I suspect that what happened was that the officer thought he could verbally "teach Bush a lesson", the young intoxicated man responded in kind, & things escalated. A scuffle ensued, & a gun went off. It may or may not have exactly occurred as the officer tells it.

    However, since there is no tape we'll never know the true story. Even if the officer is being truthful, his memory is clouded somewhat by emotion & trauma (if not out & out butt-covering).
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:16 PM EDT |
  76. Randy D from Canada writes: Am I the only one who finds it astounding that senior cabinet ministers in Gordon Campbells government read reports which must have disclosed some of this stuff and came to the conclusion there was no need for a formal inquiry???
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:56 PM EDT |
  77. Christopher Kiely from Canada writes: If this was the only blemish on the RCMp's record I would be more willing to agree with many of the pro-police posters here. But the fact is this is just one of many very "questionable incidents" involving the RCMP.

    Police officers are people, just like eveyone else, pinning a badge to your chest does not make you any better of a person or any less of a jerk than any regular citizen.

    My only experience with a cop's "word" (an OPP officer), proved he was a lying sack of crap.
    • Posted 25/05/07 at 12:59 PM EDT |
  78. Ottawa Mens Centre.com,

    from Ottawa Police Corruption Capital, Canada)

    wrote: Canadian Police increasingly do indirectly what they are prohibited from doing directly. That is, they are brainwashed by extreme feminists that should "arrest that man" to keep the child with the mother" because to do otherwise would be to committ the sin of feminist herecy. Every day, The Ottawa Men's Centre receives calls from fathers across Canada who are arrested by police on simply a woman's spoken allegation without a shred of supporting evidence. Canadian Police increasingly see themselves as a feminist customer service organization and operate like a pizza delivery service except just have the easiest number to remember, 911. And, when the Police "deliver" they rarely leave with the father in handcuffs. The father's burden is not just handcuffs, the police know very well that the man will probably lose his job, have a restraining order preventing any contact with his children and have no income to hire a lawyer to fight the criminal charges that could take up to a year to dispose off while little miss Georgia Peach gets to set the status quo for custody not to mention impute an income and have him thrown in jail for not paying support when she is the one who permanently terminated his employment. Some police have the courage to apply the law and not follow the 'standing orders" to go arrest someone on a 911 call". I've lost count of the police who have told me "they have to arrest someone" in a domestic call, even if it was just the neighbours reporting a couple having a yelling match when they both had one to many beers in their own home and neither called the police. In the Ian Bush case, his family lawyer is to be commended, it takes real courage for a family lawyer to go public and odds are this lawyer will find himself pulled over for years to come for all sorts of weird excuses by the same police. www.OttawaMensCentre.com

    • Posted 25/05/07 at 1:12 PM EDT |
  79. Ottawa Mens Centre.com, from Ottawa Police Corruption Capital, Canada)

    wrote: Typo Error in Previous post - should have read "they (the Police) rarely leave WITHOUT the father in handcuffs. and That is, they are brainwashed by extreme feminists that they (the Police) should "arrest that man" to keep the child with the mother" because to do otherwise would be to committ the sin of feminist herecy. To expand on this, Police see themselves as the unofficial judges in family law, they have the power to saddle the father with the cost of an unfounded undeserved criminal charge and all the associated prejudice that they know will almost guarantee a mother custody. Feminists influence police and judicial training to the point that we have "Feminist Sharia Law" in Canada that means a woman can make any outragious allegation and that a man is assumed guilty until he found not guilty which includes sending him bankrupt, ruining his reputation and employment, and making sure his children never see him again, all in the name of Political Correctness as degreed by feminists rather than any principle of law and in obvious violation of the biggest sick joke in Canada called "Charter Rights". If you are male, a father, a victim of a mentall ill violent woman, you have next to NO legal rights and you face a cess pool of judicary that has a pathological hatred towards fathers who dare utter such feminist herisy that the mother has a problem. www.OttawaMensCentre.com

 

 

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